PlayStation Community Thread

[DerNebel]

Both graphics updates and PS4 feature support like shareplay should be built into the emulator. That takes practically zero work per game.

If there's no retroactive cross buy with PS2 classics, then it's definitely greedy. Consumers expect digital games to be future compatible forever, and Sony themselves fueled this expectation by making almost all digital PS4/Vita ports free to existing owners. I can play Journey, Sound Shapes, Escape Plan, Flower, The Unfinished Swan, FEZ, etc. on PS4 even though I bought the games on PS3. PS3 to PS4 ports with fully upgraded graphics and gameplay are free, yet PS2 emulation with added trophies should cost money? That's ludicrous!

Plus Sony doesn't exist in a bubble. Microsoft just released 360 BC on XBO and it's 100% free for both digital and physical games. Sony looks super greedy in comparison.

Sorry, but I absolutely disagree. Getting every game to work on the PS4 and to not only work like they did back in the day but better in terms of graphics and performance, I can't imagine that not taking work on a game by game basis. If that wasn't the case then we wouldn't be, like I'm expecting, only getting a handful of games after over 2 years in the life of the PS4. And adding trophies to all games isn't happening on its own either.

Also why would consumers expect digital games to be future compatible forever? We've had several instances already that prove the absolute opposite is the case with games like P.T. or the Scott Pilgrim simply being taken of the marketplace and thus disappearing.

And finally MS did BC, just that, no bells and whistles, yeah some games run a little more smoothly but a couple apparently even go in the opposite direction, yeah that's cool but it's not the same thing Sony is apparently doing here. The comparison between X1 BC and PS2 game emulation on PS4 is one that comes easy, but that seems flawed to me. But even if we consider that MS is also putting work on a game by game basis into this then that just makes MS generous, for whatever reason you want to choose, it doesn't make Sony greedy for wanting their work to be paid for. You don't call someone greedy for asking you to pay for the food he gave you, just because another guy is giving you food for free, if that comparison makes sense.

[Xevross]

Feels so much like a scene from James Bond.

I know! She's a carbon copy of Moneypenny!

[Rorono]

Driveclub VR will be playable at PSX
Guess it's a real thing now and not just a demo

[kitler53]

imo,..  sony should release ps2 classics BC for free.  i can't imagine ps2 repurchases will amount to enough revenue to outweigh the good/bad will of the decision. 

not sure about legal implications though.  maybe the fudgy lawyers are the ones in the way.

[DerNebel]

imo,..  sony should release ps2 classics BC for free.  i can't imagine ps2 repurchases will amount to enough revenue to outweigh the good/bad will of the decision.  

not sure about legal implications though.  maybe the fudgy lawyers are the ones in the way.

Yeah simply giving away games they don't own the rights to isn't in Sonys power either, so on top of making the games work they'd also have to pay third party publishers for that right presumably.

[Legend]

Sorry, but I absolutely disagree. Getting every game to work on the PS4 and to not only work like they did back in the day but better in terms of graphics and performance, I can't imagine that not taking work on a game by game basis. If that wasn't the case then we wouldn't be, like I'm expecting, only getting a handful of games after over 2 years in the life of the PS4. And adding trophies to all games isn't happening on its own either.

Also why would consumers expect digital games to be future compatible forever? We've had several instances already that prove the absolute opposite is the case with games like P.T. or the Scott Pilgrim simply being taken of the marketplace and thus disappearing.

And finally MS did BC, just that, no bells and whistles, yeah some games run a little more smoothly but a couple apparently even go in the opposite direction, yeah that's cool but it's not the same thing Sony is apparently doing here. The comparison between X1 BC and PS2 game emulation on PS4 is one that comes easy, but that seems flawed to me. But even if we consider that MS is also putting work on a game by game basis into this then that just makes MS generous, for whatever reason you want to choose, it doesn't make Sony greedy for wanting their work to be paid for. You don't call someone greedy for asking you to pay for the food he gave you, just because another guy is giving you food for free, if that comparison makes sense.

You're misunderstanding the tech behind emulation. Upgrading resolution is common for emulators. I'm pretty sure even some PS2 discs on PS3 did this. Adding trophies and doing QA is what would require work, but all things considered it's not bad at all. If we end up with only a handful of games, then it's because only a handful of publishers were interested in the first place.

Not just console games, but the entire entertainment industry has been moving towards digital products needing to only be bought once. Buy a PC game, never have to buy it again. Buy an Apple game, never have to buy it again. Buy a digital movie, never have to buy it again. You can change and upgrade hardware yet all your purchases follow you. PS4 and XBO were practically the only entertainment devices stuck in the past, yet architecture was blamed as the reasoning: PS4 ports were still cross buy. It's the way the overall industry has been for years now.

Sony didn't do bells and whistles either. Just trophy support is special. Share Play, DVR, better performance, etc. are all what should be expected with emulation. Reason XBO BC performance isn't better across the board is because they're doing 7th gen vs 6th gen games.

Personally charging for BC like this is greedy on its own, and Microsoft's offerings just shine a light on that. One company is saying "fudge you give me money"* while the other is handing out free donuts.


*said in AngryJoe voice

[Rorono]

Sony Europe trademarks Dark Cloud, Rogue Galaxy, The Mark of Kri, and War of the Monsters - Gematsu

[Mmm_fish_tacos]

gamrConnect Forums - View Post

The way Sony is handling emulator is pretty lame.


 I like the visual and performance upgrades the emulators are doing. I think its unrealistic to expect physical disc support (its a miracle X1 has it). But at the very least they should get out PS1 and PS2 Classics from PSN on PS4. Also, they should have a PSP emulator.                

I dit think he knows what disk based backwards compatibility means.

And actually,  I think people are over reacting. It never said you'll have to rebuy classic.  Just the ps3 version, will not work. And disk will not work. Id wait for details.

[the-pi-guy]

PS2 emulator on PC is really amazing.  You can up the settings and some games legitimately look cleaner than the vast majority of PS3 games. As long as the emulator works, that wouldn't be a lot of work.  After building the emulator, the next hardest thing would probably be trophy support.  Which would likely not be as much work as one would expect.  Sony wouldn't have to guarantee perfect emulation for every game.  They certainly did not achieve that for ps3.
I think hardware emulation only worked for like 98% of games , while software was much lower.  Might be wrong on the numbers , but I recall it being less than 100%.  

[Raven]

gamrConnect Forums - View Post

I dit think he knows what disk based backwards compatibility means.

And actually,  I think people are over reacting. It never said you'll have to rebuy classic.  Just the ps3 version, will not work. And disk will not work. Id wait for details.

Yeah I was thinking about this earlier. It sounds more to me like "your PS3 version of this emulated game and its saves will not work in the PS4 version". Kind of like how your Vita version of Flower doesn't work on PS4. They could still announce retroactively crediting you for any PS2 games you bought on PS3. Basically cross-buy.

[DerNebel]

You're misunderstanding the tech behind emulation. Upgrading resolution is common for emulators. I'm pretty sure even some PS2 discs on PS3 did this. Adding trophies and doing QA is what would require work, but all things considered it's not bad at all. If we end up with only a handful of games, then it's because only a handful of publishers were interested in the first place.

Not just console games, but the entire entertainment industry has been moving towards digital products needing to only be bought once. Buy a PC game, never have to buy it again. Buy an Apple game, never have to buy it again. Buy a digital movie, never have to buy it again. You can change and upgrade hardware yet all your purchases follow you. PS4 and XBO were practically the only entertainment devices stuck in the past, yet architecture was blamed as the reasoning: PS4 ports were still cross buy. It's the way the overall industry has been for years now.

Sony didn't do bells and whistles either. Just trophy support is special. Share Play, DVR, better performance, etc. are all what should be expected with emulation. Reason XBO BC performance isn't better across the board is because they're doing 7th gen vs 6th gen games.

Personally charging for BC like this is greedy on its own, and Microsoft's offerings just shine a light on that. One company is saying "fudge you give me money"* while the other is handing out free donuts.


*said in AngryJoe voice

I understand the tech behind emulation.

Stuff like remasters still exist on PC and they are being resold to people as well, you don't get those for free for already owning the game either and I'm not believing for one second that the movies you've bought now digitally will entitle you to once again remastered versions at 4K once that becomes the norm, no freaking way are they letting people get that stuff for free.

But to not have this thing get drawn out here, I'll just finish by saying that this thing is not free for Sony, each game they put on there, especially if it's from third parties, comes with a cost involved for them and thus it does not make them greedy to not give us these games for free, it does earn MS some much needed brownie points for doing so, but that still doesn't mean that people are entitled to the same from Sony. Things would be different if they promised free BC, but they didn't. If you don't like it, you're of course free to complain or just not buy any of the games (which is what I'm likely going to do), but I'd just not throw the word greed around so much with stuff like this, as more often than not there is a lot more to it than just that.

Also AngryJoe isn't someone that I think grasps the costs involved in game making/ game business, but that's entirely beside the point here.

[Legend]

Yeah I was thinking about this earlier. It sounds more to me like "your PS3 version of this emulated game and its saves will not work in the PS4 version". Kind of like how your Vita version of Flower doesn't work on PS4. They could still announce retroactively crediting you for any PS2 games you bought on PS3. Basically cross-buy.

That's what I'm hoping/expecting.

Would just be so "non Sony" for them to charge twice.

I understand the tech behind emulation.

Stuff like remasters still exist on PC and they are being resold to people as well, you don't get those for free for already owning the game either and I'm not believing for one second that the movies you've bought now digitally will entitle you to once again remastered versions at 4K once that becomes the norm, no freaking way are they letting people get that stuff for free.

But to not have this thing get drawn out here, I'll just finish by saying that this thing is not free for Sony, each game they put on there, especially if it's from third parties, comes with a cost involved for them and thus it does not make them greedy to not give us these games for free, it does earn MS some much needed brownie points for doing so, but that still doesn't mean that people are entitled to the same from Sony. Things would be different if they promised free BC, but they didn't. If you don't like it, you're of course free to complain or just not buy any of the games (which is what I'm likely going to do), but I'd just not throw the word greed around so much with stuff like this, as more often than not there is a lot more to it than just that.

Also AngryJoe isn't someone that I think grasps the costs involved in game making/ game business, but that's entirely beside the point here.

Yeah remasters exist, but these aren't anything of the sort. Guess that's where our difference of opinion is coming from.

[DerNebel]

That's what I'm hoping/expecting.

Would just be so "non Sony" for them to charge twice.
Yeah remasters exist, but these aren't anything of the sort. Guess that's where our difference of opinion is coming from.

In terms of what is changing between the PS2 originals and the games on PS4 we're looking at the territory of many remasters.

[darkknightkryta]

We can only hope what they talk about on the disclaimer is just legal to save them from "Why isn't OdinSphere working on PS4?"  Worst case scenario "Why do I have to buy OdinSphere again?".  If the option is playing all my bought PS2 games looking like it's running on a PS2 vs having to buy them again cause they had to QA trophies, I'd take it without trophies.

[Legend]

IKEA the game