General Discussion Thread

[Aura7541]

It's because the crazies/extreme members of GamerGate are completely delusional.

Plus there are so many things messed up about "GamerGate" itself. Origins are sketchy/weird, many people disagree on what they're even fighting for, and the general media has presented it in a horrible light. Like look at this. Doesn't matter who put the posters up, it still makes the GamerGate movement look like shame.

The whole thing is just a shame show. IMO it's best to just stay out of that mess. I'll debate ethics and sexism in the industry and I'll actively do what I can to help the industry move forward, but I won't hitch my wagon to a horse I can't control.

I agree that it has been a total shitshow, from both sides. The main problem I have with anti-GamerGate people, though, is that they keep bringing misogyny into the conversation. That is their go-to argument, almost every time. Yes, Zoe Quinn, Brianna Wu, and Anita Sarkeesian have received threats. However, it hasn't been proven that all threats have been linked to GamerGate. People just assume the threats to be done by GamerGate supporters. Unless an FBI investigate confirms those threats to be linked to people who support GamerGate, we can't say one way or another.

I also don't like how much publicity their threats get from the media. It happens to everyone who receives a lot of attention. I mean, it's still deplorable, but the women are (unfortunately) not the exception. Meanwhile, the media ignores the "dead mouse impaled by a razor blade" threat Milo Yiannopolos received. That is sick as heck, but it gets overlooked by the media.

I definitely respect your neutrality. It's just that I'm tired of the misconceptions being parroted time and time again.

[the-pi-guy]

Can someone explain gamergate?

[Aura7541]

Can someone explain gamergate?

[Dr. Pezus]

I'm home from Rome

[7H3]

Can someone explain gamergate?

A reporter was naughty with people... GamerGate people want a higher standard of journalism instead of shrills... anti-GG are mostly SJW's who I think just tagged along for the ride to boost their own infamy ...

very very short of it

[Aura7541]

I'm home from Rome

That rhymed!

A reporter was naughty with people... GamerGate people want a higher standard of journalism instead of shrills... anti-GG are mostly SJW's who I think just tagged along for the ride to boost their own infamy ...

very very short of it

The Zoe Quinn scandal was the tipping point that caused GamerGate to take off, not the instigator. Gamers were calling journalists out on corruption before the scandal happened. The reason why Zoe Quinn got so much attention over Jeff Gerstmann's firing from GameSpot or the Doritos/Mountain Dew product placement in Geoff Keighley's interview was because of the misogyny narrative.

[Legend]

Can someone explain gamergate?

Well sure! Both 7H3 and Aura gave you pro gamergate answers, so I'll balance it out by posting a washington post article.

The only guide to Gamergate you will ever need to read - The Washington Post


"This all kicked off on a very specific, if no less troubling, issue. In 2013, an independent game designer named Zoe Quinn released a free game called Depression Quest. ...in mid-August, one of Quinn's ex-boyfriends claimed... that she had cheated on him with several men in the gaming industry — ostensibly to get ahead in her career.

One of those men was a writer for the prominent gaming site Kotaku... While both he and Quinn denied the allegations that she somehow traded naughtiness for coverage, outraged gamers had already taken to Twitter, Reddit and 4chan by the tens of thousands to protest...

The problem with that argument is that Gamergate's biggest "protests" don't appear to have any relation to ethics or journalism — not even a tangential one. Instead, anonymous hackers posted Quinn's personal information, including her address and nude pictures, shortly after her ex's blog went up. Conspirators on Twitter purportedly made sock puppet accounts to spread the "scandal," then bragged about it on 4chan. Some of the people sent Quinn death and rape threats so specific, so actionable, that she fled her house and called the cops.

Meanwhile, the male journalist whose ethics were (purportedly) at the center of the whole kerfuffle is still writing for Kotaku — which, for the record, ruled that neither he nor Quinn did anything wrong.

Initially, the "movement" appeared to be about Quinn — or at least about what she represented... But within days, Gamergaters had also attacked Anita Sarkeesian, a feminist writer and media critic, after she posted a new video in her ongoing series about women and gaming. She, like Quinn, was forced to leave her home.

Shortly after that, two other women who wrote about Quinn and Sarkeesian — Jenn Frank, a gaming journalist, and Mattie Brice, a game designer — announced that they would withdraw from the industry over the resulting harassment they received. Frank articulated the real issues at hand in her essay for the Guardian, which would later get her bullied offline: Gamergate, she wrote, is less about ethics, and more about drowning out critics of traditional, patriarchal, dude-dominated gaming culture.

For the record, the "drowning," in this instance, wasn't just run-of-the-mill Internet nastiness. In many cases, these women received highly graphic, disturbing threats — the stuff of "SVU" episodes. And in a few cases, anonymous Twitter trolls went so far as to include the woman's address or an exact time of attack, making the message a "true," i.e. criminally punishable, threat.

That isn't to say that everyone flying the #Gamergate banner is sexist/racist/crazy, and that isn't to say there aren't some decent arguments about journalism ethics being made. But whatever voices of reason may have existed, at some point, have been totally subsumed by the mob."

[Aura7541]

@Legend Have you watched the #SPJAirplay #GamerGate debate, by any chance?

[Legend]

@Legend Have you watched the #SPJAirplay #GamerGate debate, by any chance?

Nope.

[Aura7541]

Nope.

You should. It's done quite well and I think it represents both sides fairly.

[Legend]

You should. It's done quite well and I think it represents both sides fairly.

If you have a link sure, but I don't really care about the "sides" in a gamergate vs anti-gamergate fashion. Gamergate isn't an organization, it's a bunch of people all using the same twitter hashtag. It has no leader, no official policies, no official stance, etc. Everyone has their own interpretation of what gamergate stands for.

[Aura7541]

If you have a link sure, but I don't really care about the "sides" in a gamergate vs anti-gamergate fashion. Gamergate isn't an organization, it's a bunch of people all using the same twitter hashtag. It has no leader, no official policies, no official stance, etc. Everyone has their own interpretation of what gamergate stands for.

Sargon's summarization of the debate if you're not going to watch the whole thing (in which I won't blame you):

[7H3]

Anita is a shrill and a plague on the community... The validity of the threats on her is highly questionable... she uses various hot topics to further her own career rather than social issues themselves... those like anita utilize and attack #gamergate for their own purposes and demonize proponents of ethics as misogynists and likewise... the SJW's like Anita are more discriminatory and generalizing towards their opposition than their opposition really is at all... it's all craziness to me...

there are issues to be addressed, and naturally are being done so, but the little benefits shrills are adding to the conversation are out weighed by them pursuing their own goals of infamy rather than actually helping anything

I do not participate in GG just have been reading news and sometimes tweets about it over the course of these things coming out....

[Aura7541]

Anita is a shrill and a plague on the community... The validity of the threats on her is highly questionable... she uses various hot topics to further her own career rather than social issues themselves... those like anita utilize and attack #gamergate for their own purposes and demonize proponents of ethics as misogynists and likewise... the SJW's like Anita are more discriminatory and generalizing towards their opposition than their opposition really is at all... it's all craziness to me...

there are issues to be addressed, and naturally are being done so, but the little benefits shrills are adding to the conversation are out weighed by them pursuing their own goals of infamy rather than actually helping anything

I do not participate in GG just have been reading news and sometimes tweets about it over the course of these things coming out....

Remember the threat at Utah University? The FBI investigated it and deemed it not be a legitimate threat, but Anita decided to cancel her talk anyways. Also, when you report threats to the police, one of the first things they tell you is to not publicize them. What did Anita do? She publicized the threat.

[Legend]

Sargon's summarization of the debate if you're not going to watch the whole thing (in which I won't blame you):

Started watching the 15 minute one.

Haha Derek Smart. Stopped watching there. I have no clue of his involvement with GamerGate, but as an indie dev he's not really the best at being honest and truthful.

From the four minutes I watched, the video presented things as I already understand them. I've been following GamerGate since the start. There are lots of good and smart people fighting for better ethics in the industry.

I'll finish up the video later.