Video Game Sales Thread

[ZhugeEX]

Can you ever accept you are wrong?

66m is SOLD.
65.8m is shipped.

C'mon you are smart than that.

He lied and you are trying to cover his lies lol

You know that when a company rep or financial document mentions sales or sold it can also mean shipped right?

Like I said, most people don't know the difference because they don't know the different terminology used. Greenberg has said nothing wrong in this case but it's clear why many people would thing he has said something wrong.

Even PlayStation 4 shipments are reported as sales in Sony's reporting. As with every company.

The fact is that he did not say sold through, he said sold. Which is perfectly legitimate.


Also I'm not covering anyones lies. I'm trying to explain to you how he's actually in the right here but it seems you're the one unable to accept this.

[ethomaz]

You know that when a company rep or financial document mentions sales or sold it can also mean shipped right?

Like I said, most people don't know the difference because they don't know the different terminology used. Greenberg has said nothing wrong in this case but it's clear why many people would thing he has said something wrong.

Even PlayStation 4 shipments are reported as sales in Sony's reporting. As with every company.

The fact is that he did not say sold through, he said sold. Which is perfectly legitimate.


Also I'm not covering anyones lies. I'm trying to explain to you how he's actually in the right here but it seems you're the one unable to accept this.

lol

You never accept and I'm not here to change that.. you can continue to try to do defense control but that won't change what happened or make him less liar.

[ZhugeEX]

lol

You never accept and I'm not here to change that.. you can continue to try to do defense control but that won't change what happened or make him less liar.

Let me ask you this.

If Sony says PS4 sales are 10 million. What does it mean?

Does it mean Sold through to consumer or shipped?

I'd appreciate if you can answer the question as it'll actually get us somewhere. It's a bit upsetting that you're calling someone a liar when you're actually being very ignorant of the situation at hand.

[ethomaz]

I don't know if real number or estimates...


EEDAR Insights @ GDC16 | EEDAR

[ZhugeEX]

Well it seems Ethomaz is not willing to learn. So for those that are interested-

There are numerous terms that can be used to describe sales.

The two most widely used are Sell In and Sell through. Sell in is usually describing when a unit is sold to retail, or shipped. Sell Through is usually describing when a unit is sold to the customer.

Companies such as Microsoft, Sony & Nintendo recognise revenue on units that they sell to retail (Shipped/Sell In). In their financials and public facing documents they will describe these units as sold or sales or shipped. Each of these terms can be used interchangeably by the company to describe sell in / shipped units. Only if a company specifies sell through is the company actually talking about sales to end users.

Here is an example of Sony's investor report where they use the term unit sales to describe units shipped/sold in to retail. Microsoft use the same term as well and both describe these as "Sales"



Therefore there is nothing wrong with what Greenberg said.

Sony have shipped 37.7m PS4's as of December 31st 2015. The statement "Sony have sold 37.7m units" also makes sense as well. As Sony have indeed recognised revenue on 37.7m units.

[ethomaz]

Let me ask you this.

If Sony says PS4 sales are 10 million. What does it mean?

Does it mean Sold through to consumer or shipped?

I'd appreciate if you can answer the question as it'll actually get us somewhere. It's a bit upsetting that you're calling someone a liar when you're actually being very ignorant of the situation at hand.

"cumulatively sold through more than 10 million units*1 worldwide as of August 10, 2014"
"Number of retail sales to consumers is estimated by SCEI. PS4 sales data in Japan collected 2/22/2014 – 8/10/2014. PS4 sales data in North America collected 11/15/2013 – 8/10/2014, in Europe and Latin America collected 11/29/2013 – 8/10/2014, and in Asia collected 11/29/2013 – 8/10/2014."

Well it seems Ethomaz is not willing to learn. So for those that are interested-

There are numerous terms that can be used to describe sales.

The two most widely used are Sell In and Sell through. Sell in is usually describing when a unit is sold to retail, or shipped. Sell Through is usually describing when a unit is sold to the customer.

Companies such as Microsoft, Sony & Nintendo recognise revenue on units that they sell to retail (Shipped/Sell In). In their financials and public facing documents they will describe these units as sold or sales or shipped. Each of these terms can be used interchangeably by the company to describe sell in / shipped units. Only if a company specifies sell through is the company actually talking about sales to end users.

Here is an example of Sony's investor report where they use the term unit sales to describe units shipped/sold in to retail.



Therefore there is nothing wrong with what Greenberg said.

I dig for years these documents... there a * below saying it is SHIPPED dude.

Show me when Sony said SOLD and that ended being shipped... try hard.

Same for Nintendo... they always says it is sell-in/shipped or sold.

Sony have shipped 37.7m PS4's as of December 31st 2015. The statement "Sony have sold 37.7m units" also makes sense as well. As Sony have indeed recognised revenue on 37.7m units.

Sony shipped 37.7m.

But that is what they sold.
PLAYSTATION®4 (PS4™) SELLS THROUGH 5.7 MILLION UNITS  WORLDWIDE DURING THE 2015 HOLIDAY SEASON

You are just proving my point... Aaron just lied.

[ZhugeEX]

"cumulatively sold through more than 10 million units*1 worldwide as of August 10, 2014"
"Number of retail sales to consumers is estimated by SCEI. PS4 sales data in Japan collected 2/22/2014 – 8/10/2014. PS4 sales data in North America collected 11/15/2013 – 8/10/2014, in Europe and Latin America collected 11/29/2013 – 8/10/2014, and in Asia collected 11/29/2013 – 8/10/2014."


I dig for years these documents... there a * below saying it is SHIPPED dude.

Show me when Sony said SOLD and that ended being shipped... try hard.

Same for Nintendo... they always says it is sell-in/shipped or sold.

Why are you quoting a press release? The question wasn't about "Sell through", which is mentioned in the press release. But about sales of x units.

Sony do not say shipped in their earnings reports.
Nor do Nintendo.

They use the term "sales".

I don't understand how you can't comprehend this. It's not hard.

But that is what they sold.
PLAYSTATION®4 (PS4™) SELLS THROUGH 5.7 MILLION UNITS  WORLDWIDE DURING THE 2015 HOLIDAY SEASON

Yes. That is what they Sold THROUGH. You're clearly not seeing the difference between.

1. SOLD
2. SOLD THROUGH

As you can see. Number 2 has an extra word.


Look. I'll be ending this here. You clearly don't know the difference between the terminology and I can't be bothered to spend more time arguing over this.
It's not a hard concept to understand the differences. But please, when you are in the wrong it is not good to argue with others.

Same for Nintendo... they always says it is sell-in/shipped or sold.

Ok. Final point. Because this is a blatant lie.

Here is Nintendo Earnings Release. They do not use the word shipped. They only use the word "Sales" and "Sold" to describe shipments to retail.



You said above that Nintendo use the word shipped. But it is used a total of 0 times. This is as I explained before. Because SOLD = SHIPPED for EVERY company out there. If they recognise revenue on a product by shipping to retail then it counts as SOLD.

Also read where it says Splatoon SOLD and Super Mario Maker SOLD and then compare that to the shipment numbers. They use SOLD to mean SHIPPED.

You can even look at amiibo sales and software unit sales to see the above = shipped.

[ethomaz]

Why are you quoting a press release? The question wasn't about "Sell through", which is mentioned in the press release. But about sales of x units.

Sony do not say shipped in their earnings reports.
Nor do Nintendo.

They use the term "sales".

I don't understand how you can't comprehend this. It's not hard.

Yes. That is what they Sold THROUGH. You're clearly not seeing the difference between.

1. SOLD
2. SOLD THROUGH

As you can see. Number 2 has an extra word.


Look. I'll be ending this here. You clearly don't know the difference between the terminology and I can't be bothered to spend more time arguing over this.
It's not a hard concept to understand the differences. But please, when you are in the wrong it is not good to argue with others.

You were the guy not understanding...

He said SOLD... there is nothing about what you are talking lol

He clear lied... it said 360 have SOLD more than it SHIPPED.

[ZhugeEX]

You were the guy not understanding...

He said SOLD... there is nothing about what you are talking lol

He clear lied... it said 360 have SOLD more than it SHIPPED.

See my update regarding Nintendo.

I mean come on Ethomaz. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend. No wonder gamers get such a bad rep.

By your definition, it means that Nintendo are lying because we all know they shipped 4.06m of Splatoon but the earnings release says sold.

Do you see your mistake now?


I wouldn't bother posting all this if I wasn't thoroughly educated on the subject myself. In fact I even get paid full time to be able to comprehend points like the above.

[ethomaz]

See my update regarding Nintendo.

I mean come on Ethomaz. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend. No wonder gamers get such a bad rep.

No there is nothing hard to comprehend and you entered in defense control.

Aaron: OVER 66m SOLD
MS: 65.8m SHIPPED

You said it was because the time frame... like they shipped OVER 200k from Dec 31st to Jan 9th.

That is flat out lie.

1. He said sold like he like every time.
2. 360 shipped 1.4m between Jan 1st and Mar 31st... you are trying to say they shipped over 200k in one week.

Like I said I can go ahead and show facts and you will deny... so why continue? He lied like he usually do... it is not the first neither the last time he did that.

[ZhugeEX]

No there is nothing hard to comprehend and you entered in defense control.

Aaron: OVER 66m SOLD
MS: 65.8m SHIPPED

You said it was because the time frame... like they shipped OVER 200k from Dec 31st to Jan 9th.

That is flat out lie.

1. He said sold like he like every time.
2. 360 shipped 1.4m between Jan 1st and Mar 31st... you are trying to say they shipped over 200k in one week.

Like I said I can go ahead and show facts and you will deny... so why continue? He lied like he usually do... it is not the first neither the last time he did that.

Defense control?

I'm not some fanboy like yourself.

I see you've also bypassed the entire discussion around shipped vs sold that you were so adamant about earlier. No doubt you'll refuse to admit you were wrong about that either. How about at least admitting you were wrong that Nintendo use "shipped" in their financials. The evidence above proves they do not use the word shipped. I'm willing to bet big money that you will never ever admit that you said that.

[the-pi-guy]

Aaron: OVER 66m SOLD
MS: 65.8m SHIPPED
You said it was because the time frame... like they shipped OVER 200k from Dec 31st to Jan 9th.
That it flat out lie.
1. He said sold like he like every time.
2. 360 shipped 1.4m between Jan 1st and Mar 31st... you are trying to say they shipped over 200k in one week.

1. For the company "sold" is very typically "sold in".  He's not "lying", any more than anyone else is.  
2.  It doesn't necessarily have to be exactly 65.8.  Could have been 65.84, and considering how well they shipped the year prior, 160k would not be crazy.  
1.4 million for about ~12 weeks, is about 116k, and that could have very well been more frontloaded if it didn't do as well as they were expecting.  Especially if they were expecting last year's numbers.  Where they shipped an average of 225k (assuming 12 weeks), so even 200k would not be unprecedented.  

You're making it seem much worse than it likely is.  

Additionally I'd prefer if the conversation would end here.  

[ethomaz]

Defense control?

I'm not some fanboy like yourself.

I see you've also bypassed the entire discussion around shipped vs sold that you were so adamant about earlier. No doubt you'll refuse to admit you were wrong about that either. How about at least admitting you were wrong that Nintendo use "shipped" in their financials. The evidence above proves they do not use the word shipped. I'm willing to bet big money that you will never ever admit that you said that.

OMG you are tying yet.

Show me Nintendo saying SOLD please like Aaron... because you are only spining until now.

[ZhugeEX]

Additionally I'd prefer if the conversation would end here.  

Yeh, I've taken it too far. Sorry.

It's just infuriating when Ethomaz does this all the time. He has to be right about everything when he actually is wrong a lot of the time. I mean If I'm wrong I'm more than happy to admit it and I have plenty of times.

[ethomaz]

Yeh, I've taken it too far. Sorry.

It's just infuriating when Ethomaz does this all the time. He has to be right about everything when he actually is wrong a lot of the time. I mean If I'm wrong I'm more than happy to admit it and I have plenty of times.

You are wrong lol and never admits.

Just stop please.