What makes Bethesda games different

Started by the-pi-guy, Dec 29, 2020, 04:54 PM

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the-pi-guy

This is inspired by this thread. But this is something I've been thinking about for a while.  There's something special about how Bethesda makes their worlds.
I'm going to break down this comparison differently.  
(I don't have the most experience with GTA, so my comparison might not be faithful there.)


From an NPC standpoint, these 3 categories view NPCs differently.  

Ubisoft: a small selection of NPCs have a purpose. Many other NPCs exist for decoration.  Villagers who have a job but you can't interact with them.  

Rockstar: similar to the above, except most NPCs at the very least are able to respond to the situation.  They have more agency, but most are just nameless NPCs who are just there.  

Bethesda: the vast majority of NPCs have names, jobs, routines, etc.  Even the ones that solely exist to be killed on sight, they still often stories, or at the very least they have possessions.  


From an item standpoint Bethesda open worlds are different. You could drop a lot of items at a spot, and those things get saved in their spots.  Items will often reset, but it's never because the game can't remember something like most games.  

I think in a way, Bethesda games are designed as life simulators first, games second.  Everything exists to be interactive.  Most games are built the opposite, there's a core gameplay experience, everything else is just there to help with immersion.

kitler53

i haven't played any bethesda game or gta but i agree that in most open world games most people are just decorations.   if that isn't the case with betheseda i can see the appeal,.. the decorative people and kind of annoying. 

i could be wrong but all of the betheseda games are in sparely populated worlds and not densely packed cities.  that is probably a necessity. 

one point the original OP brought up that i think is on point is that in the "ubisoft" style games the open world mostly acts as a chcklist of things to do.  its part of why i think linear games are generally better than open world.   in games like infamous i don't think the open world actually improved the gameplay experience but rather served as a innefficient menu system....


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the-pi-guy

i haven't played any bethesda game or gta but i agree that in most open world games most people are just decorations.   if that isn't the case with betheseda i can see the appeal,.. the decorative people and kind of annoying.

i could be wrong but all of the betheseda games are in sparely populated worlds and not densely packed cities.  that is probably a necessity.
They are pretty sparse. I'd make an estimate for Skyrim:
Probably ~8 towns with an average of 10 or so people.
Probably 8 larger cities within the range of 20-80 people.  
With a number of people scattered throughout the world.  

None of them are bustling cities, but they still feel big enough.

kitler53

They are pretty sparse. I'd make an estimate for Skyrim:
Probably ~8 towns with an average of 10 or so people.
Probably 8 larger cities within the range of 20-80 people.   
With a number of people scattered throughout the world. 

None of them are bustling cities, but they still feel big enough.
they feel big enough, i presume, because they are filled with things to do.   in soo many games a town can be huge and filled with people and places and still feel completely empty because everything is just a decoration.

i should really pick up skyrim and see for myself but it sounds better and might just be why i had/have for a long time a fairly negative view of open world compared to linear.   part of what i like about linear is their is little to no "filler" which is what i'm used to in open world.  ...but i've only played "ubisoft" style open world according to that OP.

i do like bloodborne style open world though.  it really like web of linear corridors as a way to get both exploration and linearly crafted gameplay.  thats my favorite.


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the-pi-guy

they feel big enough, i presume, because they are filled with things to do.   in soo many games a town can be huge and filled with people and places and still feel completely empty because everything is just a decoration.
Aye, it's a big part of it

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i should really pick up skyrim and see for myself but it sounds better and might just be why i had/have for a long time a fairly negative view of open world compared to linear.   part of what i like about linear is their is little to no "filler" which is what i'm used to in open world.  ...but i've only played "ubisoft" style open world according to that OP.
I don't know if Skyrim would be the game to change your mind. I generally hear Oblivion and Morrowind did a better job with their open worlds.

>part of what i like about linear is their is little to no "filler" which is what i'm used to in open world

Alternatively it seems possible everything would end up feeling like filler.

But still, I think Skyrim is great and it does a lot most open world games don't do.

Plus it's $16 on PSN right now.

Legend

Bethesda games are rpgs/lite immersive sims while Ubisoft/Rockstar games are lite rpgs. Read Dead 2 is especially bad in this regard. The world is incredibly built with every NPC having a purpose, but the game punishes players for not playing the intended way.

BOTW is similar to a Bethesda open world because even though the NPCs suck, the player feels free when exploring and manipulating nature.

MGSV is similar to a Bethesda open world because even though it's heavily structured, the player can approach combat from any direction in their own way.

The Outer Worlds is similar to a Bethesda open world because even though it has very small maps, the player can kill anyone and actions have consequences.

I also just finished Watch Dogs Legion. It had the lite immersive sim feel even more than Skyrim at times. Would randomly find friends/enemies of people just out and about. I was playing as my favorite hitman and accidentally ran over his best friend cause I was driving on the sidewalk. I felt super bad about it.

darkknightkryta

I'm guessing the ability to grab everything off of a table?  I mean, I don't think there's another set of games out there that let's you steal plates and horde them around.