I need to talk about Star Wars, there is something everyone missed

Started by Legend, May 10, 2022, 11:45 PM

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Legend

I've been watching every main star wars movie and I noticed something really strange when I watched episode 8.

The movie has its stupid parts, but The Last Jedi is very "traditional." I remembered it as a big shakeup that went against Force Awakens and everything it was building, but it's not. Characters like snoke and the silver stormtrooper are respected about as much as villains in the original trilogy/prequels. They get their final showdowns just like Darth Maul, General Grevious, Count Dooku, Jengo Fett, Boba Fett, Jaba the Hut, and the emperor himself.

Unlike Force Awakens it switches up a bit more, but it's still very very similar to The Empire Strikes back. Luke acts exactly like Yoda, Del Toro betrays them like Han, the salt planet is like Hoth, etc.



My big TLDR is that I bet Disney and most people involved were surprised by the reaction. They thought they were just repeating the formula, yet it's widely considered the anti-movie.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Rose saving Fin is still incredibly dumb though lol. It's so stupid and out of place, also proving that this movie isn't a deep rebuttal of Force Awakens. I'd love the film if that was cut.

the-pi-guy

May 10, 2022, 11:53 PM Last Edit: May 10, 2022, 11:58 PM by the-pi-guy
I still haven't seen the 8th and 9th episodes.


I should really get the new trilogy on Plex...

I was under the impression the issue people had wasn't with the actual content, but just that it was "political".

kitler53

May 11, 2022, 12:48 AM Last Edit: May 11, 2022, 12:51 AM by kitler53
here's a fun fact:

all of the star war movies are crud.  the only reason the original trio is highly regarded is because the graphics were really good in it's time + nostalgia.    ..but story telling wise they are all terrible.
          

Legend

I still haven't seen the 8th and 9th episodes.


I should really get the new trilogy on Plex...

I was under the impression the issue people had wasn't with the actual content, but just that it was "political".
People tried to make it political, but ignoring that most people think it's anti star wars in one way or another.

BananaKing

here's a fun fact:

all of the star war movies are crud.  the only reason the original trio is highly regarded is because the graphics were really good in it's time + nostalgia.    ..but story telling wise they are all terrible.
Agreed

I can see how starwars for its time was considered good. Kinda like how avatar came out and was so impressive visually and scope wise, so it was a success.

But now if you look at it, it's a crud movie

Legend

here's a fun fact:

all of the star war movies are crud.  the only reason the original trio is highly regarded is because the graphics were really good in it's time + nostalgia.    ..but story telling wise they are all terrible.
From a modern perspective, the first three are still pretty great.

The quality jump from the first to the second is huge however. Much higher budget and not a "one man show" from George Lucas.
Agreed

I can see how starwars for its time was considered good. Kinda like how avatar came out and was so impressive visually and scope wise, so it was a success.

But now if you look at it, it's a crud movie

nnodley

I agree that star wars in general is pretty mediocre.  But i frickin loved Jedi: Fallen Order.  Bout the only thing in the star wars universe that i really care about.

Now avatar on the other hand is great. How dare you shame that movie.  :P Though i do agree avatar has an average story, but everything else elevates it so much more, imo.

BananaKing

I agree that star wars in general is pretty mediocre.  But i frickin loved Jedi: Fallen Order.  Bout the only thing in the star wars universe that i really care about.

Now avatar on the other hand is great. How dare you shame that movie.  :P Though i do agree avatar has an average story, but everything else elevates it so much more, imo.
Avatar is better than starwars. Its not a 1:1 comparison. My point is, avatar blew up because it was something we never seen before visually, (specially with 3d). Starwars blue up because it was something completely new and unseen before in the 70s.

Avatar had a decent/average story. It wasn't bad.


kitler53

From a modern perspective, the first three are still pretty great.

The quality jump from the first to the second is huge however. Much higher budget and not a "one man show" from George Lucas.
i'm 100% behind bananaKing here.  

i like the world of star wars i guess.  i mean, light sabers are cool as hell.   there are very interesting designs in the various aliens as far as costumes go.  the idea of a planet destroying ship was interesting (the first time).   but the format and story telling in the movie is just terrible.   the new movies copy that format and get trashed for it but its true to the star wars formula,.. it's just a bad movie formula.  

i've yet to watch any of the disney+ series yet but i'll bet that is the best star wars has to offer.   the long series format just HAS to be a better format for telling a meaningful story in this universe.   it's a space soap opera where nothing can be even half way explored as they try to fit into a 90 minute format so every scene is highly abbreviated, characters are shallow, and story line takes abrupt unjustified transitions.   

in the new movies one of the things to be annoyed about is how rey went from a nobody to a fudgy jedi juggernaut without anything in between.   well guess what,.. so did luke.   

also, i'm fudgy tired of death stars.  if you can't come up with something other than a death star just don't make another star wars movie.

Avatar is better than starwars. Its not a 1:1 comparison. My point is, avatar blew up because it was something we never seen before visually, (specially with 3d). Starwars blue up because it was something completely new and unseen before in the 70s.

Avatar had a decent/average story. It wasn't bad.
...it was kind of bad.    beautiful movie but the story was derivative at best.
          

Dr. Pezus

Avatar 2 will flop I think

Relative to the original ofc. The novelty is gone.

Legend

Avatar 2 will flop I think

Relative to the original ofc. The novelty is gone.
I had those fears till I rode the Disney ride. The movie still might end up meh overall, but I'm confident they'll wow people once again.



i'm 100% behind bananaKing here.  

i like the world of star wars i guess.  i mean, light sabers are cool as hell.   there are very interesting designs in the various aliens as far as costumes go.  the idea of a planet destroying ship was interesting (the first time).   but the format and story telling in the movie is just terrible.   the new movies copy that format and get trashed for it but its true to the star wars formula,.. it's just a bad movie formula.  

i've yet to watch any of the disney+ series yet but i'll bet that is the best star wars has to offer.   the long series format just HAS to be a better format for telling a meaningful story in this universe.   it's a space soap opera where nothing can be even half way explored as they try to fit into a 90 minute format so every scene is highly abbreviated, characters are shallow, and story line takes abrupt unjustified transitions.  

in the new movies one of the things to be annoyed about is how rey went from a nobody to a fudgy jedi juggernaut without anything in between.   well guess what,.. so did luke.  

also, i'm fudgy tired of death stars.  if you can't come up with something other than a death star just don't make another star wars movie.
...it was kind of bad.    beautiful movie but the story was derivative at best.
I had a perfect response typed out that would have changed your mind but I lost it so...

TLDR:I used to think like you till I rewatched them last week. I'm not the biggest fan of star wars.


As for Avatar, how is this not deep!?!? /s


(the background is a us flag)

nnodley

Avatar 2 is gonna be huge, imo. I think the people hating avatar is so loud online that people forget they don't speak for the average consumer. Most people seem to be pretty hyped about it

kitler53

i don't see how avatar 2 can even come close to avatar 1 with theaters in such a bad place right now.  

also, unless i'm missing something about some grand new technology being introduced this is going to have sequelitize.   even if the story is better.  even if the graphics are better.   ...3D is old hat now.  

it doesn't necessarily flop but it won't be a blow-out like avatar 1 was.
          

the-pi-guy

I don't think most people hate Avatar, I just generally see that it's weird that the movie didn't have much of a cultural impact.  
Which feels strange for the biggest grossing movie ever.  

You look up Avatar, you get the TV show.
I hardly ever see memes about Avatar the movie, whereas The Lord of the Rings is constantly memed.  

kitler53

I don't think most people hate Avatar, I just generally see that it's weird that the movie didn't have much of a cultural impact.  
Which feels strange for the biggest grossing movie ever.  

You look up Avatar, you get the TV show.
I hardly ever see memes about Avatar the movie, whereas The Lord of the Rings is constantly memed.  
to be honest,... it's been a while and the only things i can specifically remember about that completely forgettable movie is:

1. how cool it was to see those 3D particle affects when that tree was losing it's seeds or whatever

2. how much my stomach dropped the moment when they took flight on those flying creatures


in other words,.. i only remember the technology.  the movie would have been a complete flop if it was shot in 2D.