Father of boy, 12, gunned down by police questions cops

Started by 7H3, Nov 24, 2014, 02:55 PM

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7H3

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/24/cleveland-shot-boy/19471925/
Quote
The father of a 12-year-old boy fatally shot by police after wielding a replica gun questioned Sunday why police did not use a stun gun to subdue him.

Tamir Rice was shot in the torso in the playground area of a recreation center in Cleveland on Saturday afternoon. He died in a hospital Sunday morning.

His father, Gregory Henderson, told the Cleveland Plain Dealer:"Why not taze him? You shot him twice, not once, and at the end of the day you all don't shoot for the legs, you shoot for the upper body."

Henderson told reporters over the weekend that his son was a "respectful" young man who minded his elders.


Why aren't police trained to avoid deadly force rather than use it in situations like this?
"It's hip to be square." - Eurogamer<br />"Shut up its art!" -Legend

Raven

Nov 24, 2014, 04:55 PM Last Edit: Nov 24, 2014, 04:57 PM by Raven

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/24/cleveland-shot-boy/19471925/
Why aren't police trained to avoid deadly force rather than use it in situations like this?


I've asked this question before and the BS excuse I get is that cops have to mind their own lives first and the torso is an easier target as it is the largest area of the body. The reality is that most people freeze up when shot anywhere and especially in an area that hinders mobility. Rarely will a person attempt to strike back after being shot as they are typically too concerned, at least immediately, with the wound they sustained. Exceptions are cases in which the individual is under the influence of a substance or is in a state of extreme anger or shock.

Cops are trained to be accurate with their firearms and most shootings involving cops seem to happen at ranges that make them missing the target highly unlikely. It is also surprising that many lethal shootings involving cops seem to happen to unarmed suspects. If they have no firearm there is no reason to even consider lethal force unless they do have some other weapon and are currently threatening someone with it.

Shooting a 12-year old is outrageous in nearly every scenario and I find it highly unlikely that the child posed an actual threat to the police that could not have been handled some other way. Even a single shot should have been sufficient to take the child down. Why were two shots fired? That just screams to me that the cops had itchy trigger fingers and were looking for a reason. At the very least, both of these officers should be removed from the force as they are apparently incapable of dealing with a 12-year old without killing them.

DD_Bwest



This isnt even close to the first time something like this has happened, and lets Take a step back for a second and think about this,  if the kid wasnt 12 but instead 19, doing the exact same thing with that fake gun, this would hardly be a news story and people would be calling him a Franz Ferdinand and trying to get shot..  yet at the same time, kids are gaining access to their parents firearms more and more frequently and a gun doesnt care how old the person carrying it is, it will still kill someone.

also you dont bring a tazer to a gun fight. they also only have a range of like 35 feet.

Raven


Spoiler for Image:
<img src="http://cbsnews2.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/r/2014/11/23/ea875dc3-555d-4bb6-b40c-d1dd980edea4/thumbnail/620x350/2bb8ccee73caf41214c2f12b6ee3ff8d/airsoft.jpg" alt="" class="bbc_img">


This isnt even close to the first time something like this has happened, and lets Take a step back for a second and think about this,  if the kid wasnt 12 but instead 19, doing the exact same thing with that fake gun, this would hardly be a news story and people would be calling him a Franz Ferdinand and trying to get shot..  yet at the same time, kids are gaining access to their parents firearms more and more frequently and a gun doesnt care how old the person carrying it is, it will still kill someone.

also you dont bring a tazer to a gun fight. they also only have a range of like 35 feet.


You also don't shoot a fudgy 12-year old twice. Once would have been enough and it did not have to be lethal. DD, you seem to keep trying to make these stories about cops shooting people an issue of "this is why America should give up its guns". Cops are shooting people who are unarmed and pets who showed no real signs of aggression, getting into physical altercations with civilians for no good reason, and harming children under the excuse that they felt force was necessary. Hell, cops kept lying to civilians that they were not allowed to record them when the truth is they most definitely are. The problem is not an issue of firearms. The problem is police officers who are being allowed to feel they are above the law, not respecting their position or others, and too many of them walking around like urban cowboys trying to get their rush by being in a gunfight.

Raven

By the way, kids aren't gaining access to firearms any more frequently than they have in the past. It's that they're not being properly educated on them and explained the consequences. Weapons are being glorified instead of being grounded to the reality of what they are. What is more frequent is parental failures on educating children in ways schools cannot.

DD_Bwest

Nov 24, 2014, 08:29 PM Last Edit: Nov 24, 2014, 09:08 PM by DD_Bwest
You shouldnt have to give up your guns. I am pro gun ownership but I think there needs to be real change in gun culture. To many people are fudgy retarded with both guns and fake guns.  People like to play movie or cod or gansta and they act in a way that will be very easily confuses.  This kid obviously had no one teach him about owning an airsoft. This kid was essentially armed.  That gun from a distance is indistinguishable from a real one.  Its shocking because a 12yo is dead but he can b just as dangerous.  Kids can be stupid and dont think about things.  If you change his agr up 7 years, this is a non story, just like the many many other times this has happened.

Cops shooting unarmed civies is a major problem but I really dont see this as one of those cases. I see this as a young kid, wjo had terrible parental guidance,  and a lack of common sense.  And as someone who owns an airsoft rifle and have owned numerous since I was a teenager, this kinda shame really pisses me off. 

You are just as likely to be killed if you have a fake gun as you are a real one.

edit:   changing rules on guns wont stop these events from happening, and they never will.  and i repeat again i am pro gun rights, but against the mindset that seems to be in so many these days(the gun culture, where its cool to point and aim them at people or seem intimidating).  and trying to train officers more also wont fix it.  there needs to be common sense lessons taught in kindergarten or something. so many common sense mistakes were made

there also needs to be a major shift in the way the public interacts with law enforcement.   when i see all these videos people like to record on youtube, all i can see is people who dont want the cops there, dont understand what is part of their job, and no one offers any kind of co-operation.   there is this attitude that people can just ignore them, do whatever they want under an umbrella privacy, while all that does is drive a further wedge between the officers and the community.  not everyone is like this, and you can find examples of smart people aswell, like in some swatting videos.  hands go up and orders are followed to the letter and communication ensues.   ive dealt with the police many times, and its never been close to violent.   

DD_Bwest


By the way, kids aren't gaining access to firearms any more frequently than they have in the past. It's that they're not being properly educated on them and explained the consequences. Weapons are being glorified instead of being grounded to the reality of what they are. What is more frequent is parental failures on educating children in ways schools cannot.
ps we should play final stand this weekend

Raven


ps we should play final stand this weekend


Mmmm shooting people... I mean what?!

the-pi-guy

The title is awful for grammatical reasons, and moral reasons.   
Awful stuff. 

DD_Bwest


Mmmm shooting people... I mean what?!
haha yea the irony..  but seriously ive been hearing good things about it..   and i just realized its monday.. i dont get enough sleep lol

7H3


The title is awful for grammatical reasons, and moral reasons.   
Awful stuff. 

title was taken directly from the article
"It's hip to be square." - Eurogamer<br />"Shut up its art!" -Legend

Max King of the Wild

If you're in a situation to fire once then you're in a situation to unload the clip. Cops aren't super human with 100% accuracy (not even close) and one bullet doesn't stop people unless immediately fatal

7H3


If you're in a situation to fire once then you're in a situation to unload the clip. Cops aren't super human with 100% accuracy (not even close) and one bullet doesn't stop people unless immediately fatal

cops shouldn't be trained to use deadly force... the situations that require deadly force should be specialized situations not common place
"It's hip to be square." - Eurogamer<br />"Shut up its art!" -Legend

the-pi-guy


If you're in a situation to fire once then you're in a situation to unload the clip. Cops aren't super human with 100% accuracy (not even close) and one bullet doesn't stop people unless immediately fatal

Some would argue that they weren't in a situation to fire at all. 
Imagine if you had a 12 year old kid who was just having a weird day and thought it would be funny to pretend to shoot at cops with their nerf gun.  Wouldn't be a good result. 

Max King of the Wild


cops shouldn't be trained to use deadly force... the situations that require deadly force should be specialized situations not common place
ridiculous