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Gaming => Game News Discussion => Topic started by: the-pi-guy on Jun 30, 2018, 03:15 PM

Title: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: the-pi-guy on Jun 30, 2018, 03:15 PM
https://www.resetera.com/threads/todd-howard-blames-sony-for-no-cross-play-in-fallout-76.52440/

Quote
Todd Howard is annoyed by Sony's stalemate attitude: "We would love to do that, but right now that's not possible."
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jun 30, 2018, 03:28 PM
It's weird how this has become such a big issue even though nothing has really changed. Rocket League was one of the first games pushing for it, but I wonder if the movement could be traced back to something earlier.

I wonder if it'll result in Sony putting more resources into BC or other features that could help get the heat off them.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Ludicrous Speed on Jun 30, 2018, 04:05 PM
Good. Hopefully more big developers pressure them, and hopefully people buy software elsewhere. I won't buy any more Ubisoft or EA titles on my PS4 because who knows what kind of account lock bullsh we might see.

None of the games people have made a big deal about so far really NEED crossplay because they're all huge titles with big player pools. Sony shills like to say "well, Sony shouldn't share their user base advantage with the others!" But were talking about games like Rocket League, Minecraft, and Fortnite. And now Fallout. These games have big playerbases already.

Where crossplay would be great is all those smaller less played MP titles with dedicated players who have trouble consistently getting matches. Awesomenauts, Evolve, Battleborn, virtually every racing game with online play, fighters, etc. Games like these, we would see big benefit for gamers.

Also, his name is Godd Howard.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Cute Pikachu on Jun 30, 2018, 04:13 PM
When even Nintendo is ahead of the curve on an online issue. You know you iced up. Wake up Sont
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Dr. Pezus on Jun 30, 2018, 04:52 PM
Lol. I remember last gen when Sony allowed cross play and MS did not.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Cute Pikachu on Jun 30, 2018, 05:14 PM
Lol. I remember last gen when Sony allowed cross play and MS did not.
Doesn't make either of them right.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: darkknightkryta on Jun 30, 2018, 05:26 PM
Lol. I remember last gen when Sony allowed cross play and MS did not.
Everyone seems to be ignoring this...
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jun 30, 2018, 08:06 PM
Good. Hopefully more big developers pressure them, and hopefully people buy software elsewhere. I won't buy any more Ubisoft or EA titles on my PS4 because who knows what kind of account lock bullsh we might see.

None of the games people have made a big deal about so far really NEED crossplay because they're all huge titles with big player pools. Sony shills like to say "well, Sony shouldn't share their user base advantage with the others!" But were talking about games like Rocket League, Minecraft, and Fortnite. And now Fallout. These games have big playerbases already.

Where crossplay would be great is all those smaller less played MP titles with dedicated players who have trouble consistently getting matches. Awesomenauts, Evolve, Battleborn, virtually every racing game with online play, fighters, etc. Games like these, we would see big benefit for gamers.

Also, his name is Godd Howard.
Locking the account like with Fortnite is crazy and should get all the backlash possible.

I don't like backlash for the lack of crossplay though. No informed gamer has ever bought a system/game and expected it'd be possible to play against people on a different console. It'd be just as random as buying a game for one system and expecting it to play on another. Crossplay between PS4 and XB1 could be cool in a lot of ways just like crossbuy between PS4 and XB1 could be cool in a lot of ways, but it's not a problem for a company to not want to support them. Eh it's great for people to express their desire for features they want. I'm just frustrated with people demanding these features as if it's anti-consumer to not have them.

I do wonder if some group/forum has been pushing these things. Crossplay has been a thing for generations and some big games talked about it so I understand why it has become popular to discuss, but other things seemingly came out of nowhere. Like calling first party games anti-consumer. How has something so obviously false become such a popular narrative online? Maybe I'm just an old man afraid of change. I don't remember last gen having such a push to rewrite the rules on how the industry works.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Dr. Pezus on Jun 30, 2018, 09:11 PM
Doesn't make either of them right.
No. But it makes MS hypocrites and explains why both did it
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Ludicrous Speed on Jun 30, 2018, 09:25 PM
Locking the account like with Fortnite is crazy and should get all the backlash possible.

I don't like backlash for the lack of crossplay though. No informed gamer has ever bought a system/game and expected it'd be possible to play against people on a different console. It'd be just as random as buying a game for one system and expecting it to play on another. Crossplay between PS4 and XB1 could be cool in a lot of ways just like crossbuy between PS4 and XB1 could be cool in a lot of ways, but it's not a problem for a company to not want to support them. Eh it's great for people to express their desire for features they want. I'm just frustrated with people demanding these features as if it's anti-consumer to not have them.

I do wonder if some group/forum has been pushing these things. Crossplay has been a thing for generations and some big games talked about it so I understand why it has become popular to discuss, but other things seemingly came out of nowhere. Like calling first party games anti-consumer. How has something so obviously false become such a popular narrative online? Maybe I'm just an old man afraid of change. I don't remember last gen having such a push to rewrite the rules on how the industry works.
It's progress. I didn't expect the Xbox One to have backwards compatibility, especially OG Xbox BC when I bought it and I didn't expect my PS4 to be updated to support HDR.

I've never heard of this "first party is anti consumer" stuff. Where are you reading this? Or are you referring to stuff like paid exclusives?
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jun 30, 2018, 09:55 PM
It's progress. I didn't expect the Xbox One to have backwards compatibility, especially OG Xbox BC when I bought it and I didn't expect my PS4 to be updated to support HDR.

I've never heard of this "first party is anti consumer" stuff. Where are you reading this? Or are you referring to stuff like paid exclusives?
BC was on previous systems so there was some anger when XB1 was first announced without it but yeah.

The "first party is anti consumer" sentiment is pretty popular on reddit and I sometimes see it on resetera. It's specifically about games developed and published by the platform holder, not paid exclusives.

Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Kerotan on Jul 01, 2018, 05:54 AM
I'll tell you who's mainly behind this movement. It's the anti Sony shills who mainly play on xbox, Nintendo and pc. They've been so salty since Sony dominated this gen and basically single handedly kept the home console market alive. This is their chance to start a movement against playstation in the hope their boxes will benefit.

Sony are dead right not to allow it, especially with xbox who have always been very hostile towards playstation. If Microsoft want crossplay so badly with ps4 there is a simple step they can apply. Allow psn on xbox. Otherwise fudge off out of the market.

It's hilarious listen to them constantly beg Sony who last gen they mocked so much. The tables have turned.

Just for lols Sony should make the ps5 crossplay compatible with the switch, steam, ios, android and ps4. The next Xbox is going to do shame again anyway so no loss to anyone.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Ludicrous Speed on Jul 02, 2018, 02:04 PM
Cool, we have GameFAQS sponsored posts here now.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Xevross on Jul 02, 2018, 02:20 PM
I'll tell you who's mainly behind this movement. It's the anti Sony shills who mainly play on xbox, Nintendo and pc. They've been so salty since Sony dominated this gen and basically single handedly kept the home console market alive. This is their chance to start a movement against playstation in the hope their boxes will benefit.

Sony are dead right not to allow it, especially with xbox who have always been very hostile towards playstation. If Microsoft want crossplay so badly with ps4 there is a simple step they can apply. Allow psn on xbox. Otherwise fudge off out of the market.

It's hilarious listen to them constantly beg Sony who last gen they mocked so much. The tables have turned.

Just for lols Sony should make the ps5 crossplay compatible with the switch, steam, ios, android and ps4. The next Xbox is going to do shame again anyway so no loss to anyone.
From what I've seen its more disappointed playstation players, like me.

"He did it first" is never a reason for anything. Sony are the bad guys for doing this, and it hurts us playstation gamers as much as anyone else, possibly even more so. Sony claimed to be "for the gamers" this whole gen, but they're proving that they care the least about gamers out of the big three.

They should just allow cross play like Nintendo and Microsoft do, it has way more benefits than downsides now.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: DerNebel on Jul 02, 2018, 04:36 PM
From what I've seen its more disappointed playstation players, like me.

"He did it first" is never a reason for anything. Sony are the bad guys for doing this, and it hurts us playstation gamers as much as anyone else, possibly even more so. Sony claimed to be "for the gamers" this whole gen, but they're proving that they care the least about gamers out of the big three.

They should just allow cross play like Nintendo and Microsoft do, it has way more benefits than downsides now.
What are the upsides for Sony?
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Xevross on Jul 02, 2018, 05:25 PM
What are the upsides for Sony?
It would end this negative press for a start, which would have lots of benefits. Would also make their gamers happier, since we can play with friends on other platforms, increase game sales on the playstation platform as people won't go elsewhere in order to have crossplay. They would avoid the danger of alienating some fans/ owners to other platforms next generation. Not to mention the extra revenue they could make from it if they make some sort of favourable deal with MS/ Nintendo. If they did it well and in a forward and positive way then they'd be receiving praise and positive press before the start of a new console cycle, which can only help.

If Sony wants to play the 'good guy' its a no-brainer. As it is right now, its just a terrible look and makes their claims of 'for the gamer' seem fake and unsupported, which they are of course, but they made it look true for a few years at least.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jul 02, 2018, 05:41 PM
It would end this negative press for a start, which would have lots of benefits. Would also make their gamers happier, since we can play with friends on other platforms, increase game sales on the playstation platform as people won't go elsewhere in order to have crossplay. They would avoid the danger of alienating some fans/ owners to other platforms next generation. Not to mention the extra revenue they could make from it if they make some sort of favourable deal with MS/ Nintendo. If they did it well and in a forward and positive way then they'd be receiving praise and positive press before the start of a new console cycle, which can only help.

If Sony wants to play the 'good guy' its a no-brainer. As it is right now, its just a terrible look and makes their claims of 'for the gamer' seem fake and unsupported, which they are of course, but they made it look true for a few years at least.
In America yeah it wouldn't hurt them that much I think, but in other markets where Xbox does poorly it'd remove the negatives of buying a non popular system.

The cat is out of the bag and I  doubt Sony can just sit on their hands and do nothing, but as you say they need to be proactive and make sure they can start crossplay discussions while they still have negotiation power.


Thinking of a future with crossplay though, it could be interesting. Right now it's just 3 consoles but I could see it quickly becoming PC 2.0 with various companies producing their own systems. On the positive side it'd push Sony to make even more exclusives.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Xevross on Jul 02, 2018, 05:48 PM
In America yeah it wouldn't hurt them that much I think, but in other markets where Xbox does poorly it'd remove the negatives of buying a non popular system.

The cat is out of the bag and I  doubt Sony can just sit on their hands and do nothing, but as you say they need to be proactive and make sure they can start crossplay discussions while they still have negotiation power.


Thinking of a future with crossplay though, it could be interesting. Right now it's just 3 consoles but I could see it quickly becoming PC 2.0 with various companies producing their own systems. On the positive side it'd push Sony to make even more exclusives.
Yeah, it may cause them to make a direct loss but indirectly or in the long run I believe it would be positive for them, not to mention the good-will and positivity it would create.

Sony has amazing exclusives, as long as they keep that up then playstation will remain this popular. All they need to do is match Xbox on price. I doubt it'd come to a PC 2.0 type of thing, but it may become close. However if that does happen, and Sony doesn't want any part of it, I think that would be bad for Sony, not good.

Not many people would want to miss out on the connect console ecosystem, I know I wouldn't. I'd only ever play exclusives on playstation. If Sony stay on the ball and allow crossplay etc. then I don't see myself ever moving to xbox or elsewhere for multiplats/ online games. As it is, I'm considering switching to xbox as my main console and just have a PS on the side for the occasional exclusives next gen, especially if Xbox continue to progress with this.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: DerNebel on Jul 02, 2018, 06:24 PM
It would end this negative press for a start, which would have lots of benefits. Would also make their gamers happier, since we can play with friends on other platforms, increase game sales on the playstation platform as people won't go elsewhere in order to have crossplay. They would avoid the danger of alienating some fans/ owners to other platforms next generation. Not to mention the extra revenue they could make from it if they make some sort of favourable deal with MS/ Nintendo. If they did it well and in a forward and positive way then they'd be receiving praise and positive press before the start of a new console cycle, which can only help.

If Sony wants to play the 'good guy' its a no-brainer. As it is right now, its just a terrible look and makes their claims of 'for the gamer' seem fake and unsupported, which they are of course, but they made it look true for a few years at least.
It would end this negative press for a start, which would have lots of benefits.

Since the negative press doesn't appear to have any negative effect on their financials, it going away won't have many benefits either. It'll be nothing but a blip and then people will go on with business as usual.

Would also make their gamers happier, since we can play with friends on other platforms

No benefit to Sony, they don't give a shame.

increase game sales on the playstation platform as people won't go elsewhere in order to have crossplay

You can't seriously believe this. People don't this. Sure some people online might proclaim that they are going to this, but in the big picture those people aren't even going to register.

They would avoid the danger of alienating some fans/ owners to other platforms next generation.

That's potentially the only thing that could happen. But here's the thing: If Sony continues to block cross play with Xbox, while allowing it with PC. Who is Xbox going to be playing with, that's going to make their crossplay such an immediately more attractive offering? Switch? That system isn't going to run next gen games anywyays.

Not to mention the extra revenue they could make from it if they make some sort of favourable deal with MS/ Nintendo.

Lol, why in the world would MS or Nintendo sign any deals that are favourable to Sony just to allow cross play? You really seem to overestimate how much these companies actually care about having cross play. Especially Nintendo, I guarantee you that the only reason they are allowing crossplay is because multiplat multiplayer games are such a miniscule part of their console business, that they simply don't give a shame. They would never in the world give Sony anything, just so Switches can play with PS4s.

If they did it well and in a forward and positive way then they'd be receiving praise and positive press before the start of a new console cycle, which can only help.

Like I said above, this wouldn't result in positive press for Sony. If everyone allows it, why would Sony receive positive press for it?

You're asking Sony to basically give up the biggest selling point their leading console has this late in the generation: Being the system to own if you want to play with your friends, because they already own PS4s.

Look at Germany for instance, do you think people here in Germany give a shame, that they can't play Fallout 76 with Xbox players? Hell, I don't know a single person who even owns an Xbox One in real life. What is Sony going to get out of positive press that people on PS4 can now play with Xbox owners here in Germany? Nothing. But MS? They can then start heavily marketing the fact, that they have the strongest console and that people can still play multiplats with all their friends even on PS4.

Why would Sony just hand that advantage, that they have in so many dang markets, out to MS?
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Kerotan on Jul 05, 2018, 03:21 AM
From what I've seen its more disappointed playstation players, like me.

"He did it first" is never a reason for anything. Sony are the bad guys for doing this, and it hurts us playstation gamers as much as anyone else, possibly even more so. Sony claimed to be "for the gamers" this whole gen, but they're proving that they care the least about gamers out of the big three.

They should just allow cross play like Nintendo and Microsoft do, it has way more benefits than downsides now.
I've asked my ps4 buddies about this and they all say fudge xbox we don't want to play with them. And these are men in their 30's and 40's who don't visit forums or read gaming news. If you live outside the US and you are dumb enough to buy and xbox you deserve to not to be able to play with your friends.

Anyway If Sony allow this they will lose sales and xbox will gain them. Lose lose for Sony.

Yeah, it may cause them to make a direct loss but indirectly or in the long run I believe it would be positive for them, not to mention the good-will and positivity it would create.

Sony has amazing exclusives, as long as they keep that up then playstation will remain this popular. All they need to do is match Xbox on price. I doubt it'd come to a PC 2.0 type of thing, but it may become close. However if that does happen, and Sony doesn't want any part of it, I think that would be bad for Sony, not good.

Not many people would want to miss out on the connect console ecosystem, I know I wouldn't. I'd only ever play exclusives on playstation. If Sony stay on the ball and allow crossplay etc. then I don't see myself ever moving to xbox or elsewhere for multiplats/ online games. As it is, I'm considering switching to xbox as my main console and just have a PS on the side for the occasional exclusives next gen, especially if Xbox continue to progress with this.
You just mentioned another negative. If cross play becomes standard then EA and Activision can make their own console and Sony loses out.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: SWORDF1SH on Jul 05, 2018, 12:43 PM
@Kerotan
There are a lot of positives to having cross-play especially for smaller games.
On the flip side nobody should expect Sony to support it when it clearly gives up a huge advantage to the competition.
I think Sony do a lot more for gamers by letting people play free-to-play games without PS Plus.
Now I do think Sony need to come up with a solution to allow cross play that is fair on them and not giving up one of their advantages to the competition. Sony have enough smart people to work out a solution.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: ethomaz on Jul 05, 2018, 01:03 PM
Crossplay is a unfair feature that some guys try to make it the second coming while gamers didn't care about.

IMO I disable crossplay in any game because it is just a pain to play against cheaters and mouse/keyboard... I want my playing ecosystem to be closed to players with the same advantages/disvantages.

While I can understand some guys wanted to play with their "friends" I don't want to see this future of cross play games in my console.

Crossplay at best should be a option disabled by default if devs really wants to implement it.

But hey let's Rockstar make a GTAVI with crossplay on all platforms to see how the sales will hit them... or Activision with CoD.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jul 05, 2018, 01:59 PM
There are a lot of positives to having cross-play especially for smaller games.
Everyone says this but if it's optional like Ethomaz and people want, then it can make things worse. The players go from being split up as Xbox and PlayStation to Xbox, PlayStation, and Xbox+PlayStation. Someone with crossplay enabled yet not required will probably have an easier time finding matches, while someone requiring crossplay will maybe have a worse time depending on system+defaults, and someone with it disabled is guaranteed to have a worse time finding matches. It's incredibly dependent on how the system is set up and how large each match is.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: ethomaz on Jul 05, 2018, 02:33 PM
Everyone says this but if it's optional like Ethomaz and people want, then it can make things worse. The players go from being split up as Xbox and PlayStation to Xbox, PlayStation, and Xbox+PlayStation. Someone with crossplay enabled yet not required will probably have an easier time finding matches, while someone requiring crossplay will maybe have a worse time depending on system+defaults, and someone with it disabled is guaranteed to have a worse time finding matches. It's incredibly dependent on how the system is set up and how large each match is.
?

Finding matches is faster in SFV with PC crossplay disabled... there is less lag and cheaters too.

SFV crossplay is a good example of why I did not support this feature.

People will talk about online active players for smaller games... if a game is having matchmaking issues due the size of the playebase it will have even with Crossplay PS and Xbox because both active player base combined will be low yet.

Why devs didn't make interesting and engaging online experiences to make the player didn't want left the game at first place? Put resources in better online matches instead crossplay that won't fix the issue of small online active players.

Smaller active player base will surfer with or without corssplay.... the difference will be like it will die today or tomorrow.

Crossplay is like somebody trying to combine two big shows... one Country music and other Rock music... thinking he will get more people watching the show when in fact you will have more people will you have two separated shows with each one number of fans.

Like I said... let's the devs (small or big) be hit by the sales of their games to see crossplay is dumb from the beginning.

Talking about consumer only Crossplay add more issues to my gaming life than make it better... in fact it doesn't make anything better... it is really a useless feature imo to play games.

It's weird how this has become such a big issue even though nothing has really changed. Rocket League was one of the first games pushing for it, but I wonder if the movement could be traced back to something earlier.

I wonder if it'll result in Sony putting more resources into BC or other features that could help get the heat off them.
It is already heat off I guess... Spider-man is coming too... while Sony output successful games these small features doesn't matter.
Title: Re: Todd Howard blames Sony for no cross play in Fallout 76
Post by: Legend on Jul 05, 2018, 03:16 PM
?

In regards to a hypothetical world in which the game didn't have crossplay.

If PS4+PC takes longer to find a match in SFV then they probably have it using a fully separate player pool. If a game did something like that, then crossplay would be bad for everyone in regards to matchmaking times. Instead I was thinking about the game dynamically placing players into the PS4 or PS4+PC pool if they had crossplay enabled.


I'd love to have crossplay as a dev option. Like you said a lot of the time it isn't really a beneficial feature (outside of inviting specific friends to play with you from a different system, that can be implemented without negatives and people would definitely like), but there are games that really should have it. Take MMO like things for example. Elite Dangerous is a space game on 3 platforms all within a shared universe. Your actions affect everyone on every platform but it's only possible for you to see spaceships of players on the same platform as you. The game would really benefit if crossplay was supported.
It is already heat off I guess... Spider-man is coming too... while Sony output successful games these small features doesn't matter.
Sony is doing great with games but they shouldn't rely on that exclusively. They don't necessarily need crossplay, but they do need to continue to add features to make people happy.